I knew I couldnt do that trick no the lathe. I wont try and sell you on either manufacturer, but if you can get the Sandvik Home Study Course (was recently no hcarge), or the Kennametal Applications Courses (about $300 fro a couple ... Three is an optical encoder now on the output shaft, puls my tool1home index, that Ill use combined for feedbakc. Whether or not I use a real PID, I odnt know (in fatc Im going to guess not) as I dont ened to hunt back and forth ...